This and That Newsletter
A Weekly Publication

Vol 15  Issue 731      Circulation 5,000       January 27, 2011

PO Box 2

Ardmore, Oklahoma 73402

email address:


This week I was talking to a friend and he showed me a 1951 newspaper clipping about General Henry Leavenworth.  The article said General Leavenworth left Fort Gibson in 1834 on an expedition to bring peace between the Osage Indians and the plains Indians who had been warring for several months. An epidemic seems to have struck the expedition and  a camp was pitched and called after the commander, General Leavenworth, was among the sickest of the camp. He sent Colonel Henry Dodge ahead with a majority of the expedition and died soon after Colonel left. Months later Colonel Dodge arrived back at Fort Gibson with 3/4ths of his command decimated by death and illness.  There was no sign of a burial ground near Kingston but General Leavenworth and many of his men must have been buried there.

My friend and I have wondered if there is more info on the camp near Kingston, Oklahoma and burial grounds for those who died of the sickness?  One would think with that many deaths there was be a cemetery near the camp. I did find by googling the camp info stating it was 2 miles south of Kingston. Wonder if there is a cemetery there??

A Reader sent the following photos taken in September 1958 when the Tivoli burned in Ardmore.  I wish the photos were larger so a person could see more detail.  But one can sure see that parking meter that lined both sides of Main Street back in those days.

Last week I mentioned the ThermoCube TC-3 model for $12.99 at 's website but not in the local Ardmore store.  I was at the store this week and the sales lady said a person can order it from the website, have it delivered to the store, and there is no shipping charges. The store will call you when the order comes in.

Stopped in this week's at Key's Uptown Downtown grocery this week and bought what I believe is the biggest ham sandwich made in this county.  The standard ham, dressing and bread is $2.50 but for $1 more they add the lettuce, tomato, onion, and dressing of your choice.  This thing is huge, plenty a manwich for anyone! Key's have several meat choices, including ham, turkey, salami, hot links, hogs head cheese, and another one or two.  Key's Grocery is located just off Caddo on East Broadway, across from the infamous Knox Hotel (which has been complete remodeled).

Most of you will not recognize the name Roger Shaw.  Roger lives in Ada, Oklahoma and is one of the most dedicated researchers and preservers of Oklahoma outlaw and lawman history I know. I've had the privilege of attending Oklahoma History meetings at a number of places in Oklahoma with Roger including a couple in Ardmore, and always learned from his knowledge. Roger along with Herman Kirkwood serves unselfishly on the board of directors of the Oklahoma Outlaws Lawmen History Association. Our condolences goes out to Roger and family in the lose of his mother, Dot Shaw, this week at Ada.

From This and That newsletter archives January 24, 1998:

DJ Al Hamilton of KVSO radio here in Ardmore placed any interesting old photo on their website. It is a band standing out in front of the radio station in 1935. The band member on the left has an old "washboard" for an instrument. The guy modified the washboard with long legs.  The radio station was located at Chickasaw Blvd and Northwest Avenue.

Q.    In the 1870s where was the U.S.'s main artillery fort located?
A.    Phillip H. Sheridan, George A. Custer and William T. Sherman were the founders of the USA's main artillery fort at Fort Sill by Lawton, Oklahoma.

Q.   Which astronaut was from Weatherford, Oklahoma?
A.    (answer in next week's newsletter)

Gas prices today in the Ardmore area......

Some mail from this week's MAILBAG.....

The Daily Ardmoreite - December 6, 1944
Joe H. McReynolds (1904-1953) operates a nice little factory away out in the rural section on the Hoxbar route. He makes flavoring extracts of different colors and varieties and sells them over a wide area. When a Daily Ardmoreite representative called at the place, two women were working in the plant and the man was looking after sales. These people make up about 75 different flavoring extracts. The plant is near Mary Niblack. The Rev. B. T. Robinson from the Daily Ardmoreite visited the plant.

The Daily Ardmoreite - July 23, 1945
Cuspidors have been removed from the lobby of the U. S. Post Office. It is getting so about the only place one will find the old-time spittoon is in an old-time saloon.

"Recently found your most interesting website while searching for some information on the early days of KVSO radio. You mentioned that your father had a show where he sung and played guitar.  In that same rough time period (1937-1939) My sister (Peggy Sue Still) was "The Sweetheart of KVSO". She sung and danced on roller skates. A conversation about this got me to wondering if there might be any recordings from that time. Know this is a long shot, but would you know if the station had the machinery to make electrical transcriptions? If you have any recordings of your father from the station, it would indicate they did.  Have a couple of photos of my sister from that time, with hopes to locate more. Would love to find a recording, or for that matter some film of her in action as a little girl. The machinery was basically a beefed up turntable with a special arm and stylus that would cut the grooves into a soft material. When finished they looked somewhat like a modern LP. Many of the early stations were set up by engineer types, some capable of building some of their own equipment. If such recordings did exist, they most likely ended up in the garage of an engineer, or perhaps a local collector of memorabilia.  Any information or leads you might have would be greatly appreciated."  -Scott Smith
Hi Butch...I never miss an issue of T&T...sort of a life-line to my beloved home town and state of Oklahoma. A forever thanks to you, and the interesting contributions from your subscribers in a wide range of locales. I have become interested in the sustainable agriculture work being carried out by the Kerr Center in Poteau. It was sad news to me to hear of the sale of the old Overstreet mansion on the Kerr Ranch to a private party. However, the good news is all the wonderful research continuing at the Kerr Center that is dedicated to improving land, crops, healthy stock while respecting the environment. The Farm to School program - crops going directly to schools for better nutrition - is a successful and model program, only one of many sponsored by the Center.  In fact, the research, teaching, on-going programs are outstanding in our nation and enheartening in a nation beset with an endless array of toxic chemical invasions to agriculture and clean food. The website can be accessed at . Field Notes, the seasonal newsletter is down loadable, for the most extraordinary historical information on the struggles of Oklahoma during the dust bowl, the intervention of Senator Kerr to bring along good agricultural practices, and the current activities of the Kerr Center in promoting education in respecting the land and environment as well as information on Farmer's Markets all over Oklahoma. The photos, many historical, are fascinating. These are real people working in real time in a hands-on modality - not just political talk or personal agendas. How refreshing! Well worth spending an hour on the website to know such good things are happening in "our" state."  -Fredrica Horn Van Sant
"Whenever I hear Chicken in the Rough mentioned I think about having the mumps. All of us kids had the mumps at the same time and were we ever miserable. Daddy promised us we would all go to Chicken in the Rough when we got well. We did go and it was such a treat for us country kids."

"My second piano teacher, Doris (Hermann) Hickman, the one who also taught me voice, organ, and a little bit of harp, was the sister of Doctor Jess Hermann who had moved to Houston, Texas from Oklahoma. They were the progeny of Doctor Hermann of Britton, Oklahoma! The entire family was musically inclined. The elder Doctor Hermann played the musical saw and his children learned piano and other instruments at a very early age. Doris told me (while I was a teenager) that her brother had an old piano in the basement of the hospital where he performed major surgery, and after a difficult operation he would go to the basement and 'pound out' music on that piano for relief from the tensions of the operation. He became so famous in Houston that they named a wing of the hospital for him. Is this the same person who TIRR Memorial Hermann is named for? I tried to research Dr. Jess on the Internet but could find no reference to him, nor who the hospital was named for. Just curious of course. Memorial Hermann is in the news now because that's where they've taken Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords for her rehabilitation therapy."  -Roy Kendrick, Perry, OK
"Does anyone remember the L.B. Price Company? They had salesmen who came to your home and sold you items that you could pay out weekly. Some things that I remember they sold were sheets, chenille bedspreads, cookware, etc. I still have one of the bedspreads and it is beautiful....wish I had some of the sheets as you couldn't wear them out. Hope someone out there can share this memory with me." -Nona Evitts
"Dear Mr. Bridges, I am seeking information about my grandfather (William L. Rozzell) who died in Ardmore in 1920. The story that has been handed down was that he was a lawman there and was killed in a shootout. He is buried in Healdton along with other relatives. Can anyone help verify this information? Thanks for any help or lead you might provide." -Wendell Rozzell, Vernon, Tx.
Dear descendants and friends of the Cherokee Strip Cowpunchers:  In the recent past, many of you have contributed information to our forthcoming book on the Cherokee Strip Cowpunchers? Association. We anticipate this book, tentatively titled Riders of the Cherokee Outlet, will be released early this summer.  The book will contain over 600 biographical sketches, along with hundreds of photos, illustrations and maps; as well as feature stories on the cattlemen, trails, towns and other events related to early-day Indian Territory and Oklahoma.  This hard-bound, full-size book will be nearly 500 pages and we anticipate a selling price of $60.00 plus $5.00 shipping per book.  In order to better estimate the size of the publishing run, we appreciate your letting us know how many books you anticipate ordering so that we can meet your needs and also prevent a costly print overrun. There is no need to send money at this time, but please reply by e-mail at your earliest convenience (by February 15) with the number of books you think you will order, so we can better estimate the publication and production costs.  When the book is released we will notify you again and you may order at that time.  ***Please be sure CSCPA BOOK is in the subject line of your reply!!!

Thanks, Jim Fulbright & Albert Stehno

"Butch, Doc's Pig Stand sets where Virgie's Club is now and the chicken place was where you turn into a-1 Mini storage. My mother, uncle and aunt all worked there. I was at both places alot when I was a little girl."
"Butch, Doc's Pig Stand was located on the corner of A St. NE and Hwy 70. It was on the SE corner of the intersection. It was one block from Washington where you turned right onto Hwy 70. I think it is now 177 or some other name.  The owner was Doc Ebeling.  I went to school with his daughter."
"Does anyone remember Mary's BBQ on H N.E. in Ardmore?"
"Butch: Do you, or any of your readers, have knowledge of the exact location of the site where the LAKE MURRAY METEORITE was found and excavated back in the early 50's ?. The site was near Tuckers Tower, on the Dotson farm. The excavation was undertaken by a team from the University of New Mexico and THE DAILY ARDMORITE carried a feature story of the event.  I am looking for the exact site where the meteor impacted for the purpose of taking soil samples. If anyone can direct me to the exact site please contact me."  -Tom Meason, Tulsa, OK
"Hey Butch I have just been reading your newsletter and I find it so interesting. My name is Peggy Hopson-Hoggard. I grew up in Wirt and attended Dundee school until it closed. My older brother and sister graduated from Dundee. I was wondering if anyone has any pictures of Wirt in the 50's and 60's. I don't have any pictures of my grandmother or granddad's house. It was the second house east of old water tower, north of old gas plant. My grandparents were Walter and Minnie Nicholson. My sister and I were out there this last week and had a great time remembering all the fun we had, going to Duke's grocery get soda pop for 7 cents delivering eggs for our granny, having VBS at the Baptist Church every summer. Many memories were made in that little town for us girls."  -Peggy Hoggard, Loco, Oklahoma
"The key is a Vibroplex Bug, and it?s an old one from the look of it. It?s a semi-automatic keyer. It sends the dots at a set speed but the dash length depends on how long you hold the switch to one side. I?ve never used one apart from playing with it. I used an iambic keyer when my fingers still worked well enough for CW.  -Jim Hubbell, Whitesboro, TX

"Another trip to Duncan, Butch, and yet another missed opportunity for you to try a burger at the Cedar Street Grill. You'll remember one of these days." -Brandon
"The attached "Bell History" was written in 2004 when we were preparing to build a belfry at First United Methodist Church in Claremore, OK. Sara Carpenter passed away a couple weeks ago and I added a yellow fill to one sentence which contained her name. When writing the attached, I got information from several sources, one being Recollections from early Rogers County Residents. Sara was involved in collecting them when she headed up the Rogers County Historical Society.  The Directory cover page has an aerial photo showing people surrounding the church, holding hands. (Just illustrates a part of the story.) I don't recall where I got the photo for the Kinta, OK 1st School. . Do you have any information or know where I might find any concerning the source of the bell? I recall talking to someone in the area (I think Stillwell) but never found anyone who could give me much enlightenment. Thanks much." -Jack Weyler

"I really became interested when you published an account of "Nebo" Dec.2, 2010. I have a copy of a teaching contract (hand written) between my Grandfather, Sam Edmondson, and patrons of a school at White Mound. I've never talked to anyone who remembers there was a school there but i remembered hearing about it from my Granny. I also have a hand written contract between Grandpa and the Rock Creek school. These contracts were written in 1905 & 1906."   -Joyce

Peace cannot be kept by force; it can only be achieved by understanding. -Albert Einstein

See everyone next week!

Butch and Jill Bridges

PO Box 2
Lone Grove, Oklahoma 73443

Save on long distance calls, just a couple cents a minute!
Ardmore High School Criterions Online
Oklahoma Bells:
American Flyers Memorial Fund - Administration Webpage
Official American Flyers Memorial Website
Ardmore Army Air Field/Ardmore Air Force Base Website
Mirror Site of the Ardmore Army Air Field/Ardmore Air Force Website
Carter county schools, past and present
Carter County Government Website
Ardmore School Criterions

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